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Author Topic: Serie A: Juventus - SS Lazio 2-0, 25/08/2018  (Read 954 times)

Cathal

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Re: Serie A: Juventus - SS Lazio 2-0, 25/08/2018
« Reply #20 on: August 26, 2018, 12:22:01 AM »

Not to sure about Wallace on the 2nd goal. If he stays with his man, I don't think its a goal.

If he stays with Ronaldo, I think it's an easier chance for Juventus than what it turned out to be, because Khedira would be unmarked and in the perfect shooting position. I think he made the percentage play and it wasn't enough.

If Marusic simply stayed with Mandzukic, it's not a goal. If Badelj tracked Khedira's run, Wallace stays with Ronaldo and the ball would never reach Mandzukic.

That's why I'd give Wallace a free pass there. He was outnumbered because his teammates didn't want to mark up.
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stefano_40

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Re: Serie A: Juventus - SS Lazio 2-0, 25/08/2018
« Reply #21 on: August 26, 2018, 12:30:42 AM »

We need to cool the jets here and actually consider, and I find it so ridiculous to have to say this, our season so far...

Comments of Parolo being deadwood, that LA shouldn't be near the pitch etc. are ludicrous. We've played two games against easily the two best teams in the league (one of whom put EIGHT goals past us last season. We lost both games, as fully expected, but with a lot of positives to be taken from our play.

-Our defense with Wallace looked relatively solid tonight. Wallace was very good.
-Acerbi, our De Vrij replacement, has essentially turned in two Man of the Match worthy performances for us, with early signs pointing to him being an upgrade for De Vrij and a boost to our whole defense.
-Badelj looks like quite an able replacement for BOTH Leiva and Parolo (a massive piece that we missed last season)
-SMS looked better tonight than he did against Napoli, showing an upward trajectory after his mere two weeks of pre season
-Strakosha, despite the fact that I thought he was not too bad at all tonight, now has serious competition from Proto. No reason to think that this won't spur him on. His passing was atrocious tonight, but Juve were always going to win the midfield battle for those long balls.
-Based off last week, Ciro is still as sharp as ever. If we give him a chance, he will take it. Unfortunately tonight he got none, but it is still reassuring.
-Alberto I don't know, there's no reason for his poor performances, but again, we played against the two most solid teams in the league. Correa looks like he can come on as a replacement and somewhat create.
- Arguably the best player of all time looked like such an ordinary player against our Lazio. A lot to be said for that when last season we made the likes of Pandev and Petagna look like Shevchenko in his prime...

I guess I'm trying to say that these two results should not come as a shock. Did anybody really think we were going to come out of these two games with anything more than maybe a point?

If we fail to beat Frosinone at home next week, then I'll be worried. Until then, I'm not at all.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2018, 12:36:51 AM by stefano_40 »
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71 min: Finally a goal in this game! It's a scrappy one, but Lazio won't care. Candreva goes down the right of the box and fires a shot at Lobont. He saves the shot put can only push it to Lulic on the other side, who stabs the ball home to give Lazio the lead!!

Secret_Samadhi

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Re: Serie A: Juventus - SS Lazio 2-0, 25/08/2018
« Reply #22 on: August 26, 2018, 12:43:34 AM »

If we were Udinese I wouldn't be worried. But, our last 4 games are 0-0-4 gd 1-7.

I don't get this we played against Napoli and Juve, so we are supposed to lose attitude. We played against Napoli who are a weaker team than last season and with a new coach. Why should we not looking for a win against this side, specially in a opener at home? Are we downsizing our Lazio that a a defeet against Napoli at home is a expected result? Are we likes of Udinese or Bologna or a team with a campionere and a 120 milion man in our team?
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stefano_40

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Re: Serie A: Juventus - SS Lazio 2-0, 25/08/2018
« Reply #23 on: August 26, 2018, 12:56:27 AM »

If we were Udinese I wouldn't be worried. But, our last 4 games are 0-0-4 gd 1-7.

I don't get this we played against Napoli and Juve, so we are supposed to lose attitude. We played against Napoli who are a weaker team than last season and with a new coach. Why should we not looking for a win against this side, specially in a opener at home? Are we downsizing our Lazio that a a defeet against Napoli at home is a expected result? Are we likes of Udinese or Bologna or a team with a campionere and a 120 milion man in our team?

I don't even consider pre season games usually, but especially not in this case. Put us up against Arsenal or Borussia Dortmund at any point in a season and 9 times out of 10 we get beaten by them. We lost four games to four superior teams, it happens.

Napoli are basically the same team team that humiliated us twice last season. Ancelotti is probably one of the best managers of the past 20 years. Yes, maybe we should have taken a point or three against them, but yes, a loss to Napoli at home has become the expected result for the past 4 seasons.

As for Juve, we beat them once in Torino in the past 16 seasons. Enough said about that.

I dunno, if this was two losses against two of Milan, Inter and 1927, then I'd be pissed. But there's a reason that we will be fighting for fourth position, while Juventus and Napoli will fight it out for the Scudetto. Again.
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71 min: Finally a goal in this game! It's a scrappy one, but Lazio won't care. Candreva goes down the right of the box and fires a shot at Lobont. He saves the shot put can only push it to Lulic on the other side, who stabs the ball home to give Lazio the lead!!

Cathal

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Re: Serie A: Juventus - SS Lazio 2-0, 25/08/2018
« Reply #24 on: August 26, 2018, 01:01:39 AM »

I don't understand the negativity, but these are not the performances of a Top 4 challenger either.

Let's say we beat Frosinone - we'll have beaten a team a mid-table side put 4 goals past last weekend - it tells us nothing.

At some point in the season, we need to win these games to qualify for the Champions League. To do that, we have to play better than we are.

Logic says we will improve but logic says Juve and Napoli will also. That's why Inzaghi is saying these last two games haven't been good enough - it's not just the result, the performance levels are not up to scratch either.
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stefano_40

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Re: Serie A: Juventus - SS Lazio 2-0, 25/08/2018
« Reply #25 on: August 26, 2018, 01:11:01 AM »

I don't understand the negativity, but these are not the performances of a Top 4 challenger either.

Let's say we beat Frosinone - we'll have beaten a team a mid-table side put 4 goals past last weekend - it tells us nothing.

At some point in the season, we need to win these games to qualify for the Champions League. To do that, we have to play better than we are.

Logic says we will improve but logic says Juve and Napoli will also. That's why Inzaghi is saying these last two games haven't been good enough - it's not just the result, the performance levels are not up to scratch either.

Somewhat agree. To requote myself:

"if this was two losses against two of Milan, Inter and 1927, then I'd be pissed"

Last season, we drew and lost against these three teams, as well as a win and loss against Juve and two losses against Napoli. We missed out on CL football by a point. 3 points out of 18 against our actual, at least in my opinion, "Champions League rivals" (Milan, Inter & 1927) is where we need to improve to move into becoming a Champions League team.

Once we get there and want to challenge for the Scudetto, that's where 3 points out of 12 against Juventus and Napoli becomes a problem for me.

Performances may not have been amazing, but we didn't let the two of them have it all their own way either like we had become accustomed to seeing.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2018, 01:13:19 AM by stefano_40 »
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71 min: Finally a goal in this game! It's a scrappy one, but Lazio won't care. Candreva goes down the right of the box and fires a shot at Lobont. He saves the shot put can only push it to Lulic on the other side, who stabs the ball home to give Lazio the lead!!

Jimmy

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Re: Serie A: Juventus - SS Lazio 2-0, 25/08/2018
« Reply #26 on: August 26, 2018, 01:47:37 AM »

Not to sure about Wallace on the 2nd goal. If he stays with his man, I don't think its a goal.

If Marusic simply stayed with Mandzukic, it's not a goal. If Badelj tracked Khedira's run, Wallace stays with Ronaldo and the ball would never reach Mandzukic.


If Capitano cared to run wih Cancelo when the attack started there wouldve been no cross either  :whistle: ... But he didnt care much for backtracking after the subs and change of formation. Not sure if its solely on him or on Simone as well...

But all in all it was a better outing. We are seriously toothless with LA and SMS being both out of form. Having no one that could actually run and succeed with a one on one doesnt help much either. Im not worried peronally, we were bound to get 0 points out of these games either way more or less. Learn from with kick the * out of Frosinone and move on as it never happend  :sciarpa05:
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rivo

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Re: Serie A: Juventus - SS Lazio 2-0, 25/08/2018
« Reply #27 on: August 26, 2018, 03:24:13 AM »

Comments of Parolo being deadwood, that LA shouldn't be near the pitch etc. are ludicrous.
....,
-Alberto I don't know, there's no reason for his poor performances, but again, we played against the two most solid teams in the league.

Watch the supercoppa 2017 and you will find the reason why LA was outpositioned in last two games and so were SMS. The default formations used were exactly the same on paper but in reality in the supercoppa LA stayed in the middle to comfortably build up the attack and SMS stays in the front to help ciro for aerial duel at least. Now however LA was outpositioned maybe due the effect of his new shirt number or simply because Inzaghi instructed so. It is like SMS was clueless as Attacking midfielder and Parolo is clueless as Defending/Central/Attacking midfielder (I am also as clueless as Parolo of what position he is responsible, most probably he chose Central Midfielder). SMS was probably outpositioned too and Parolo was hmm simply clueless in almost all games. SMS must be somewhat a vice Ciro or the likes like Mandzukic and Parolo is best to be a sub so he know exactly what he should do, defend the midfiled. Being a defending midfileder slighlty in front of Leiva, Parolo can launch his long pass but Just dont expect him to build up the attack so he is best to be sub defending midfiled.
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Cathal

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Re: Serie A: Juventus - SS Lazio 2-0, 25/08/2018
« Reply #28 on: August 26, 2018, 09:30:13 AM »

Somewhat agree. To requote myself:

"if this was two losses against two of Milan, Inter and 1927, then I'd be pissed"

Last season, we drew and lost against these three teams, as well as a win and loss against Juve and two losses against Napoli. We missed out on CL football by a point. 3 points out of 18 against our actual, at least in my opinion, "Champions League rivals" (Milan, Inter & 1927) is where we need to improve to move into becoming a Champions League team.

I don't agree with this.

We were a 'Top 4 team' last season - we missed out on Champions League on head-to-head by conceding two late goals in the final game to an opponent that played about 15 games less than us in the season.

To finish in the Top 4, you simply have to score more points - and as we found out, maybe have a superior head-to-head - than 16 other teams. It doesn't matter if you get those points by routinely beating the best teams in the league or the worst teams in the league or a mix of both - you just have to get points.

Where we will both agree is that games against direct rivals have more importance as you are not only gaining points but you are taking points away from the opposition. 'Six-pointers'. And while you've decided Juventus and Napoli will fight it out for the Scudetto, I'm not convinced. Few people are predicting Napoli to be fighting for the Scudetto this season, and Juventus have rolled the dice and the CR7 gamble might not pay off - based on what CR7 has shown so far, it doesn't look like smart business.

That's why I won't play down losses at home to Napoli and Juventus. These results might end up being the difference after 38 games.

But it's the performances that worry me. Chievo and Milan did a better job against Juventus and Napoli respectively than we did against either. And in my opinion, if these two games reflect our 'normal' level for the coming season, we won't finish in the Top 6 never mind challenge for the Top 4. We have to improve.

There was a complete lack of effort from the team on Juventus' second goal; an attitude we just didn't see from the lads last season. SMS and LA have a lot to live up to this season and already they are coming in for criticism. Immobile has to prove last season's form isn't the best we'll ever see of him. Acerbi has a long way to go yet to prove he's changed our fortunes in defence. Lulic, Parolo, Radu etc. are fighting against time and at some point will lose.

My point is, I've forgotten about last season because it's a new season and a new team and this team has to show where it is this season. We finished 3rd in 2014 and it became apparent 2-3 games into the next season that side - with much the same personnel - was going to finish nowhere close.

After taking 0 points in the opening 2 games, making claims we can challenge for the Top 4 is a bit like Empoli claiming they can win the Scudetto. We need to zip it and play better. Once we show THIS SEASON that we look like a Top 4 challenger, then I'll not care about what we've shown against Napoli and Juventus.
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Roman_Eagle

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Re: Serie A: Juventus - SS Lazio 2-0, 25/08/2018
« Reply #29 on: August 26, 2018, 09:35:59 AM »

Too many long posts for the simple truth - we did not develop as a team during the summer. We are not ready for the season either - not phisically, nor tactically.
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